Announcer: Wall Street Unplugged looks beyond the regular headlines, heard on mainstream financial media, to bring you unscripted interviews and breaking commentary direct from Wall Street, right to you on Main Street.

Frank Curzio: How’s it going out there? It’s November 17th. I’m Frank Curzio, host of the Wall Street Unplugged podcast, where I break down headlines and tell you what’s really moving these markets. Awesome show lined up for you today. It’s being sponsored by Masterworks, who’s tokenized the $1.7 trillion art industry, to where anyone can own a piece of the finest art in the world. Daniel, how’s it going, man? How’s everything?

Daniel Creech: What’s happening, Frank? Good morning.

Frank Curzio: How’s the weekend?

Daniel Creech: It was good.

Frank Curzio: Yeah?

Daniel Creech: It was good. Yeah. I went, I didn’t really do much. It was pretty boring, but boring is good sometimes.

Frank Curzio: Yeah. And, it’s getting cold in Florida, actually, it was in the forties for most of this week. Right? Which is insane in Florida.

Daniel Creech: Yeah. Hit the thirties and forties in the evenings and mornings. So yeah, I had a sweater on several times. I did play nine holes of golf. That was good, coming back into it. So, all the subscribers will be happy, my golf game is turning around. So therefore, I must have been working too hard there for a while. My handicap went up.

Frank Curzio: No, that’s awesome. That’s awesome, man. So look, a lot going on with the markets, right? We’re having a lot of fun here. Well, some people are having a lot of fun, not if you own Peloton, or if you bought Tesla at 1200. I think we can go there. I had a lot going on with Tesla where man, the news is crazy. Yeah. Elon Musk, using tweets to sell stock, it is falling. Lawsuits, I mean, it’s hard to gauge his stock. I like how crazy he is, don’t get me wrong, but not to the point where, yeah. What Bernie Sanders, do you want to sell more stock. What did he say to Bernie Sanders? That was pretty funny though. He didn’t say…

Daniel Creech: Yeah. I mean, Bernie Sanders was on his typical, “Tax the billionaires.” And just a fun word game could be converted into a drinking game for everybody out there listening, is if you hear fair share, nobody gives a number because numbers require thoughts and then they would require a defense. If you’re backing that up for some reason, you’d have to use logic and, or such things that all politicians try to avoid. But whenever you say, “Well, hey, what should your tax rate be?” They say, “Well, it should be your fair share.” It’s not 50%, 60%, 80%, whatever. So, that’s always interesting. So Barry, or Bernie, was on that, and I’m no fan of Musk in the sense of, I think he’s great at making a clown show out of the markets, but that’s okay. It’s nothing, I don’t make those rules, but he is entertaining. I have to admit.

Daniel Creech: And we talked last week and joked about how him taking the Twitter poll and how that’s just part of it, if you’re a Tesla investor and he’s been right so far. Now, Bernie Sanders was on the tax thing again. And he tweeted back to him, and I’m paraphrasing here but, “I keep forgetting you’re still alive,” to Bernie Sanders. Which, he is just digging. It’s going to get publicity. Everybody’s talking about it. Hell, we’re talking about it. But I do respect how he calls people out. He doesn’t shy away. He loves to argue. He loves drama. That’s doing all well.

Daniel Creech: And then another piece, JP Morgan is apparently suing him, or suing Tesla, over not fulfilling warrants and, or some kind of deal. So it just, there’s always something going on there. He has sold a lot of stock. Yeah, if you bought it recently, are you upset? Yeah, you’re probably upset, but is the story changed of anything? And we can get into that in Bitcoin later, but if you’re a Tesla buyer and you’re bullish and it’s down 15%, has anything else changed other than the stock price? I would argue, no, but I’m not a bull nor a bear on that. I’m just an observer from the sidelines.

Frank Curzio: Yeah, no it’s interesting. So, it came up finally on all, on everything that he sold. He said he sold those 1.2 million shares. I think it was options, I will grant it to them, for over a thousand dollars, which is $1.2 billion. And while people are so funny to say, I love the headlines, “Tesla is in a bear market.”

Daniel Creech: Hey, technically they are, you’ve got to give them credit.

Frank Curzio: It’s in a bear market. It’s up a hundred percent from its March 2021 lows. And it just went up like 35%, in what, a month and a half? And then it pulls back 20%. It’s in a bear market. Now it’s a bear market territory. It’s just to me. I love it. I love it. It’s like, watching TV will make you crazy sometimes. I mean, one day it’s, “You got to sell everything.” The very next day, when the market goes up, “You got to buy everything.” So it just, it’s… Sometimes, it’s better you just shut off, and turn out the noise.

Frank Curzio: But another stock that I saw, which is interesting, is Peloton. And that stock has come down even more. Right? They reported really bad earnings and sales, which I think everyone knew would eventually happen. I can’t believe where that stock went. I mean, I’m going to post something up right now, but yeah. Now, they announced that they’re going to raise money. Right, Daniel, so?

Daniel Creech: Yeah. A billion, right? That’s a round number.

Frank Curzio: Yeah. It’s a billion. But this is a company, and I’m going to try to bring up the chart here for you.

Daniel Creech: What’s wild about that, while you’re pulling that up, Frank, is the 13Fs are starting to come out now. And we’ve talked about these many times after earning season. If you have over a hundred million dollars in assets under management, all the big wigs, Berkshire Hathaway, Stanley Drunkenmiller, Dan Loeb, we’ve talked about a number of these guys that we like to follow and look through, but all these 13Fs are coming out, these reports. Now, remember, we always have to say this, take this with a grain of salt because they have what, 30 days or something after the quarter to release these. So, they may not hold every single position that is on this screenshot or snapshot here.

Daniel Creech: But I say all that because, Viking Global Management or hedge fund, they increased their position during the quarter in Peloton from around a half a million shares to almost six and a half million shares. Now, if you have the chart up there, it has not been a good quarter. So, they could have already blown out of this. They could have been buying it on the way down and then just said, “To hell with it. We’re going to pull this and take our losses.” They may still hold it. You’ll have to wait until the next, end of January for until they report the fourth quarter holdings.

Daniel Creech: But that shocked me, because it’s easy to say that now, after a terrible report and the stocks gotten crashed, but this does seem to be a very dangerous cycle downward on, “Hey, we peaked during the coronavirus, we got a huge pull forward.” And now, you really have to believe in a brand that’s going to somehow start making money eventually. I mean, are you going to continue to pay up for burning cash? And Kuppy had a great Twitter thread on this. Did you see that at all today?

Frank Curzio: No, no. I didn’t see it today.

Daniel Creech: He just pointed out, he refers to as Ponzies, like a Ponzi stock, Ponzi scheme, and he just said, “Hey, there’s, you’re not making any money. Your growth is slowing tremendously, and you need capital. Like, what the hell do you deserve a premium for now?” And he’s basically just saying, selling will cause more selling, and more selling. Anybody should check his Twitter feed. But yeah, I don’t know what you want to say about that. But when I was going through these 13Fs, seeing that huge increase in stake shocked me.

Frank Curzio: Yeah. When I look at this name too, I mean, you’re down 70% from its highs, and down tremendously, over 50% in the quarter. They said they didn’t have to raise money, right? Now, they’re raising money. And I’m just curious to see this, too, which I’m going to pull up in one of my systems here. But when I look at Peloton, it’s a company that’s losing money, right? So, if you’re losing money and all of a sudden your stock price crashes, right? So, you’re spending tons of money on marketing, tons of money on marketing, right? So Peloton, every place, your billing needs, your systems, and everything. And all of a sudden, you see your stock crashing and that’s also on, what is it? $1 billion less that they planned, that they are estimated that they’re going to generate. It gets crazy.

Frank Curzio: I mean, now it’s like, “Holy shit, you’re raising a billion dollars.” And the stock is actually up 70% today on this. But I mean, again, it’s after being down so much, but now, you’re losing the credibility from the analysts as well. And I’m just looking at these numbers here, and I’ll show you on my Capital IQ system. This is Peloton, guys. So 2021, 2022, you’re looking at earnings per share. They expected losses all the way to 2025. Right? So, that’s okay. I mean, 2022, before all this nonsense, it was close to $3 a share you’re going to lose. That might not seem like a lot, but it turns out to almost a billion dollars, right? So, you’re losing a billion dollars. So, raising a billion dollars is a very big deal.

Frank Curzio: I mean, you might look on the revenue line and say, “Look, these guys are generating four, four and a half billion.” That’s going to come down tremendously. But at the end of the day, if you are generating $4 billion and you’re not generating any returns on that product, and you’re losing money on it, that’s not a good thing. And you see that, that’s the business model nowadays with growth companies, right? It’s get everyone to the platform, get as many people as you can, spend as much money as you can, use your stock as currency to roll up, buy all this fricking companies, that’s all fine and dandy when you have a great growth market or whatever. But once that growth slows, which you’re seeing with a lot of stay at home stocks, right, Daniel? I mean, these stocks were just, you couldn’t work out. You couldn’t go to gyms. Now, it’s different. People love going to gyms. They love getting out of the house. They don’t just want to be a bicycle all day. So, a stationary bike.

Frank Curzio: So, you’re seeing a lot of, when that growth slows, this is what happens to companies and this company got nailed. Is it a buy here? I don’t know, but I’d like to know when, and you said that, right? Who was it? Viking Global, I believe, that came in, and this is like the 13Fs guys. We cover this a lot, 13Fs. What the biggest money managers, if you’re managing over a hundred million dollars, have to come out and disclose their holdings. They do it every quarter. So, they could have bought the first couple weeks in a quarter and sold two months ago. You don’t know, but Viking Global, I mean, their position in Peloton was huge. Huge. It’s very small to six million shares. So if I had to guess, they probably got wrecked on that one, and blew out of that position.

Frank Curzio: But let’s go with 13Fs as well, because this is where I find ideas. I found several ideas in a newsletter that are up a lot, and I want to make it clear to you guys. And 13Fs for me, and how you look at this, and it’s not hard to find. You can find these anywhere. I do at briefing.com. They don’t pay me. I think Fly On The Wall does it. You could probably do Google searches, and you’re going to see all, Soros, Jana Partners, Bob Horowitz, Seth Klarman, Duquesne, ICON, all of them, they’re going to list their holdings and they list what they’re buying, what they bought last quarter. And some of these names are like, “Whoa.” They’ll just catch you by surprise.

Frank Curzio: And others aren’t, like David Tepper increasing his position in Macy’s to seven million from 30.6 million. Also, increases his position in Kohl’s going into the holiday season. And Macy’s, that’s pretty big. And then, I also saw Jana Partner’s brand new position, four million shares in Macy’s. Right? So Macy’s, are you kidding? Macy’s is a company that everybody thought might have gone out of business. Now, you’ve seen some of the big hedge fund managers buy, but it’s not necessarily that I want to follow these guys into Macy’s. So, if they have a new position and maybe it’s a small cap, I’m like, why are they buying this? And you might see that small cap have a bad quarter. And depending on the manager, some of these guys scale into these positions. So, if they’re scaling in, you know they’re going to buy more after the stock goes down.

Frank Curzio: So a lot of times, I’m able to recommend these things, 10, 15% discounts to where they originally purchased. And I know they’re going to be adding, and it provides a floor in a stock for me. And that’s when I can really research these companies. And as I’m researching, I’m not running into buy what these guys are buying, but I have them on my radar, and looking, and saying, “Hey, if these decline, I’m definitely going to take a look at it.” And look, there’s several stocks out there that you’ll find on this list, that you’d be like, “What the hell is he buying that for?” And that’s the one you want to research. And that’s how I take it. I don’t know how you’d take it, Daniel, but we love looking at this and we cover this. And, this happens every quarter.

Daniel Creech: Yeah. Another great resource for this is Whale Wisdom. I believe that’s a free site. They list a lot of… They track a handful, or I don’t know if it’s 10 right off my head, but just go to Whale Wisdom and see that. We need to get them as a sponsor, giving them a plug every quarter. But yeah, I mean, that’s how I came across Upstart Holdings, looking through Dan Loeb’s 13Fs. That’s AI powered, helps banks with consumer loans. They use technology and algorithms to increase the amount of loans, and decrease the defaults. So, obviously, you’re making more money. That’s a great thing.

Daniel Creech: Frank, I got to say, I laughed out loud when I saw your Twitter feed, because you reposted a video of somebody. I believe he was on CNBC. And he said he was, “Buying Upstart, and it was up X amount since,” which has gotten pulled back big time since its quarter. Reported a good quarter not too long ago, but the stock is well off its highs. Anyway, the guy said, the anchor said, “Oh yeah, what’s Upstart do? I’ve never heard of that.” And the guy, he did the old, “What’s that? You’re cutting out. I can’t hear you.” So, yeah.

Frank Curzio: So, the guy went on TV.

Daniel Creech: You got to just say, “Hey, you know what? We’re a trading platform. I don’t know what the hell it is. I like the chart. I like this,” or whatever. It doesn’t matter. But, you want to comment on that?

Frank Curzio: I do. I do want to comment on that.

Daniel Creech: Because, I meant to call you out on pulling that up. So, I’ll do it now.

Frank Curzio: That guy, so the guy went on CNBC and he’s like, “Well, we got Upstart, it’s up 35%. And, we’re doing really well on that.” This and that. And the anchor’s like, “Upstart? What do they do again? What do they do again?” He’s like, “Sorry, I can’t hear you. I can’t hear you.” So, he didn’t even know what the company did, but he is recommending it on TV to everybody. And this wasn’t a guy that recommends stocks based on trading. And it just goes to show you, where we are in the market. Right? For me, that’s been doing this for a very, very long time, and I see this shit in a newsletter. There’s so much bullshit in it. And then you see it on TV now, where you can get people on there.

Frank Curzio: They don’t understand the freaking responsibility, Daniel, that people are actually listening to them. I don’t give a shit if you make money, I don’t give a shit if you lose money. But, if you’re giving people advice on a platform that people look at for new ideas, know your shit on the stock. You could be wrong and that’s fine, but not knowing what the company does and telling you to buy that stock, which by the way, happened to be pretty much at the top. Right? Right before the thing did fall, that has to get cleaned up in our industry. And, you know what? That goes to the platform that’s putting him on. You got to vet these people a little bit more, make sure that they know this stuff. Make sure they’re experienced.

Frank Curzio: Don’t just throw a guy on because he has a lot of people on his platform, because I know people on Twitter, I know people on, especially YouTube and kids that have three million followers, talk about stocks and they don’t even, they were like, “Yeah, this company came out and had five quarters this year of good growth.” It’s… Yeah, they don’t even know the fundamentals. And, they have millions and millions of people following them. And you just have to be careful who you listen to. But that’s the platforms. Like me, I’m vetting everyone that I interview on this podcast, and then I’ll monitor them. And sometimes, they’ll give us ideas, and we’ll track some of those things in Dollar Stock Club. But, there’s credibility there, where it’s my job to put the right people in front of you. And that, for that big of a platform, that to happen, that was crazy. But anyway, let’s get back to the 13Fs. I had to comment on that. Sorry, man.

Daniel Creech: No, that’s good. Anyway, so two, I’ll give you two names here that I had not heard of. And you just go through these, like I said, and see the tickers throw them in, whatever platform you’re using, and just see what they do. Start putting them on watch lists or whatever you want to follow. DFH, Frank, Dream Finders Homes. I had never heard of that. It just started recently trading, I believe it was in January of this year. And they have a mortgage company side of it, but they design, build, sell single family home, and attached and detached homes. They’re in Jacksonville. They’re in Orlando, Denver, Washington, DC, and Austin, Texas, as well as Charlotte and Raleigh. If you look at a chart, do you have a chart pulled up?

Frank Curzio: Yeah, it’s gotten wrecked.

Daniel Creech: Yeah. And it started trading, was it January? Is my memory serving me correct?

Frank Curzio: Yeah. I think it’s in January. Yeah.

Daniel Creech: Okay. So, at spiked high, it’s gotten wrecked. I’ve seen that on a hedge fund here and there. So, that’s one to just throw on a watch list. Hey, are they going to still buy it? Are they still holding it next quarter? Are they increasing? Are they closing? Decreasing? Whatever. That was interesting to me. And then also from Tepper was ALIT, which is A-L-I-T. You got that one over there, Frank? Those of you listening at home, we don’t talk near as much. We’re all, we’re both very busy. We catch up a lot right here on air.

Frank Curzio: We catch up a lot right now and just go with it. Absolutely. That’s good.

Daniel Creech: Another one has… Is that pulled back?

Frank Curzio: That has back off its highs of like $14. And that was recently, actually was just, was 14 earlier this year. And then in September, October. So, September 9th, it was 12.50, a little over 12.50. So, it pulled back. It’s like around $11, little over 11 right now.

Daniel Creech: So, this is a new position for Tepper. It’s a cloud-based, integrated, digital-human business solutions worldwide. So, think payroll solutions, professional services, all that for small businesses and big businesses automated. There’s a big tailwind behind that. Again, I’m not saying whether these are good or bad. These are just stuff that I’ve been writing down, starting to look through, pull up conference call transcripts, things like that, because you ought to take advantage of looking at these 13Fs be, because you literally have the wealthiest and smartest guys in the room that do this all the time. A lot of them have great track records, and there’s no gun to your head. You don’t have to pull the trigger. You don’t have to do anything, other than look and start making notes and figure out how to get better at it.

Frank Curzio: Yeah, And, Daniel, I have the chart up while you’re talking, but for this company, ALIT in the symbols, A-L-I-T, I’m pulling up the three month chart. Because, Tepper probably bought it early here, if you could see, and that’s in maybe August, and you see the spike up, right? So, somebody’s buying it. And then it comes down and he might have bought a little bit more, but don’t look at it, right? Because, if you’re looking at it just over the past month or so. So, this is not even the past month, past week almost, on the ninth, it hit $12 and now, it’s come back down to 11, a little over 11. That’s a nice pullback right here. And you’ve seen the stock up a little bit today because, these 13Fs are being released now, and appetite.

Frank Curzio: One name that I liked, that caught my attention was Stanley Drunkenmiller. So, 15 million new shares. That’s a pretty big position. And it, the symbol’s CPNG. So, it’s called Coupang. I’d never heard of it before. This is a company that was $69, and it’s near its low. It was near its low before they announced that they bought this. A very big fund, and it’s a career based company, e-commerce, mainly home goods, decorator, apparel, beauty products, fresh foods and stuff like that. Operates e-commerce logistic systems, delivery services. This is something that’s interesting to me. What does he see in this? And when I look at some of these things, or especially a name, I like these and the one that you brought up Daniel, and I’m bringing this up now. This is Coupang, C-P-N-G.

Frank Curzio: I like to look at names that have gotten smoked, that they’re buying right now. And especially names that I really don’t like. Not because I researched them. It’s just that I know these companies and they’re really crappy. And I’m like, “Okay, this just showed up on David Einhorn’s list. What does he see in this company that I’ve hated for such a long time?” And it makes me go back again. I talked about this yesterday. Being able to adapt to the markets. It’s not personal. It’s not like, “I hate this stock forever.” Look, you can complain, even at a company like IBM of how terrible it’s been the last 15 years.

Frank Curzio: It’s, did this company change? Where is it at now? And that’s what you’re buying into the future. And sometimes that’s hard to separate, because everyone looks at a company and they view it on the past. Just like you view everything on the past, your experience in the past. If you go down a certain block and get the shit kicked out of you, the next time you go down that block, you’re going to think you’re going to get the shit kicked out of you. Right? That’s just the way it is. So, you always view things based on the past, but sometimes, you have to forget that. And this allows me to forget it by looking at some of these.

Frank Curzio: Last trend here, Daniel, I’ll say that I saw with a lot of these guys is they’re selling out of big tech names. I saw a lot of them sell out of big tech names, which not really so surprised. I mean, Soros sold out of AMD and Apple, Seth Klarman sold. He lowered his positions, Intel, eBay, but I just, across the board, just decreased positions. This is Duquesne Capital, which I just mentioned, who owns a CPNG. Decreased positions at Facebook, Palantir, Microsoft. So just little things like that, that I saw, but you could always get new ideas. And like we just said, right, Daniel, it’s keep these on your radar and look at them. These are the smartest people in the world. They have tons of analysts. They have access to information beyond belief. Not that it’s inside information, but the people in the right circles hear information first before everybody else, especially on new trends.

Frank Curzio: That’s why I try to travel. That’s why I’m going to Baltimore this week to look at a great biotech company that I may be recommending. That anti-age drug, that I’m going to John’s Hopkins to see it personally, and talk to scientists and doctors. But, you want to be in those circles, and you never know: One of these things might come up where you’re like, “Wow, what is this stock?” And CPNG just happens to go up a ton. You’d be like, “Wow, that was a stock that fricking Stanley Drunkenmiller was buying. Holy shit.” So, that’s how we really look at this. Right, Dan, it’s probably the best way to do it.

Daniel Creech: Yeah. We need to talk about Bitcoin real quick? Or, can we talk about one more worthless investment opportunity?

Frank Curzio: Let’s talk about Bitcoin real quick. Before we get to that, I just want to say, look, our market has been on fire. Wall Street Journal says ours has been one of the hottest markets on earth. Masterworks has come back to be our sponsor, because we had so many people sign up to them, because that was after I interviewed Scott Lynn a few weeks ago. This is a company that’s tokenizing the $1.7 trillion art market. We tokenized our company. So, you guys know what that is, but what it means that, you could buy a portion, a small piece of some of the greatest artworks around. And that’s important, because this has been one of the hottest markets, easily outperforming the S&P 500 the past 20 years. These guys are now being valued at a billion dollars in the last capital raise. They’re doing a great job. There’s a reason why we see a lot of people on our site. It’s not only a platform, it’s a company I trust. It’s a company that I’m on as well as this platform. So yeah, that’s masterworks.io.

Frank Curzio: But after interviewing Scott, he set up a special offer and a lot of people are taking advantage of it. So, where you can go and by past a request invitation part, which is kind of like a fancy way of, “Hey, let’s, we’ll go through the process and then we’ll email you.” You don’t have to do all that, right? So you immediately get access to everything, where you can see all these paintings, you can invest right away and see the whole platform. So to do that, they set up a special link just for my listeners, which is www.masterworks.io/wsu. So, that’s www.masterworks.io/wsu. Getting a lot of requests for this really cool site. Check it out, but again, for the first time ever, you can invest in some of the finest pieces of art, which was only available to the elite. And, this is what tokenization does, is doing it across every industry, which is Wall Street, real estate, especially unlocking un-liquid assets. And you’re seeing this market really, really start to take off and very exciting. So, I’m glad that Masterworks came back, and they’re our sponsor again. It’s a company that I really, really like.

Frank Curzio: So, Daniel, let’s get to Bitcoin falling. Holy cow, Bitcoin is falling. What are we going to do? It’s not down so much. Right? But it’s still over 60,000 I think. Right? And they’re saying China continues to clean up the crypto mining market, which is the reason why it came down. That’s what they’re saying, even though I think China has banned crypto, I think they’re up to seven times this year.

Daniel Creech: Give or take.

Frank Curzio: Right. Six, seven times that they banned. I think once you ban it, you ban it, right? It’s like, I’m never talking to you again, Daniel. And then having you on the podcast and saying, “I’m never talking to you again, Daniel.” And you’re saying it every single week, right? People are going to be like, “Daniel’s not going to be on anymore.” I’m like, “But I’m never talking to him.” But yet, you’re on every week. I love this as a reason for, again, there has to be a reason, right? To have behind everything. You can’t just say, “Stocks go up or down,” or whatever goes up and down. But, I find that interesting with Bitcoin pulling back, a lot of cryptos pulling back. But for me, look, I’m welcoming this pull back. If you’re someone who signed up, we had a lot of people sign up to Crypto Intelligence, and they started out the gate really, really well, which I’m happy with. We want this. We want a pull back.

Frank Curzio: I mean, I know that Bitcoin’s going to be a lot higher three years from now. I don’t know where it’s going to be three months from now. I know that this move was incredible, but you’re taking small positions in these stocks, and being able to add to them. If you look at the positions in my portfolio, Crypto Intelligence, you got to see 30X, 20X winners. I mean the average position was up well over 600%. The average position, that includes a couple of losses. Those positions, some of those that you see with the highest gains were down 30, 40% for us. But we had very small positions that we added over time.

Frank Curzio: So, with this industry, that’s crazy, where you see a five, 7% move in a day, and everyone’s like, “Crypto’s crashing.” They’re not talking about it going up tremendously this year. They’re just talking about, “Hey, it’s off of 67,000 of as its high, now 60,000.” And, they have all these excuses, but if you’re investing in this industry the right way, you’re kind of welcoming this pullback, right? It’s going to give you a chance to invest in a lot of names that were really expensive, that may have pulled back.

Daniel Creech: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, nothing has changed other than again, they point to China headlines, they point to evidently in the infrastructure bill, there was a tax reporting or a transaction reporting with Bitcoin. So, they’re kind of saying, “Hey, a lot of those people were getting nervous, so they’re going to sell some now.” Yeah. Just be, I mean, this is just what Bitcoin does. It’s very volatile. Nothing has changed for the bulls or bears other than the price. I’ll give you the real reason why Bitcoin has dropped so much, is because I bought more of Galaxy Digital yesterday. No shit. So of course, that’s why. I should have put out a tweet on your account or whatever, since I don’t have my own yet. But that’s why, that’s the true reason why everything is down 10% because I added to my Galaxy Digital position, which I’ve been buying over time and I’m fine with it. It’s okay.

Daniel Creech: What’s interesting is Cointelegraph, which is a great free site for… Quick note on these sites. So CoinDesk, and Cointelegraph, and Decrypt, and there’s several out there that are very good. Those are just the three that are on the tip of my tongue. CoinDesk recently changed their, what do you call it? Platform, or view. When you go to coindesk.com now, it’s changed recently and it is terrible. I don’t even know what I’m looking at anymore. It’s that bad. Whoever decided to do that, once things are so good, it’s like how Apple keeps upgrading things on their phones and they change. There would be no innovation if it was left up to me, Frank, that’s why it takes all kinds to make the world spin around, because I’m the guy that says, “Hey, when this looks, when this works.” Drudge Report, best fantastic news site in the world, only because of the simplicity of it. It’s just lists. It’s just lists. I love that.

Daniel Creech: Anyway, little rant there, that just drives me nuts. I can hardly even look at CoinDesk anymore. But Cointelegraph, which has not changed it and not run away their viewership, was highlighting how a whale, supposedly the third largest Bitcoin address. What’s that mean? That means it has a shit ton of money, okay, in Bitcoin. And it was buying, this address has been buying more Bitcoin in November, and they bought more at 60 or 62,000. And they put another 12 million in it. Now, the naysayers out there are going to say, “Well, when you’re worth, call it 12 billion-ish, what’s several million?” But that’s not the way to look at this. The way to look at this is, “Hey, somebody has a huge position and they’re adding to their position at these prices.”

Daniel Creech: Does that mean the bottom is in? No, it just simply means to, I don’t want to agree with you on everything just because we’re on the same team here, but scaling in. I’ll say the same thing like I said, when we had this conversation, when Bitcoin broke out about 20,000. Would you recommend people buy it at 20,000? Yes, unless that’s the only time you’re going to buy it. Now, it proved to be correct, because it’s still well above that. But the idea, you got to get out of this mindset of, “Hey, I’m going to take X amount right now and put that into this idea. And this is either going to make me rich or go broke.” That is just not an overall smart way to invest. So, get in the habit of saving a little bit. You don’t have to invest every month, but save a little bit, always have dry capital and scale into these positions.

Frank Curzio: Yeah. I mean, you know what I’m pissed at the most is that they found a way to track my Bitcoin holdings now. So, I got to be careful. Yeah. Because that’s me buying.

Daniel Creech: Oh, nice. Wonderful.

Frank Curzio: Yeah, so.

Daniel Creech: Oh, I look forward to this Christmas bonus season.

Frank Curzio: And those million dollars mean a lot to me. I’m down a little bit right now. So, don’t. I think you’re saying stuff, and that matters to me. I’m a little pissed off right now.

Daniel Creech: Do I still have this up? They threw out a fund, the current balance of this address. Now, this is not timely. So this is a little off, but it’s 108,528 in change Bitcoin. An unrealized income of four billion, 632 million. Ouch.

Frank Curzio: And you know what’s great about that? Anyone, that could be anyone. That could be anyone, think about that. It could be us.

Daniel Creech: Well, it can’t be. It can’t be us because we’re both still in this room and not on a Gulfstream, flying.

Frank Curzio: No, I’m not talking about that. I’m talking about, it could be anyone that started buying crypto that early. That could have been any, like a lot of times you’re looking at when deals like Rivian come out, right? And, you had Ford, and Amazon in early, and investors in at $5, $7. That can’t be anybody. Right? I mean, most people, you’re making money on Rivian. Good for you. You bought it after whatever, a hundred bucks and it’s 150, 60, whatever it is today. But in crypto, that’s what’s so exciting, because you could buy into something at, in the pennies, that could be 20, 30, 50, $70, a hundred dollars. And you don’t have that opportunity a lot.

Frank Curzio: And that’s what’s exciting because look, people like to gamble, they want to speculate. And everybody, everyone listening to this should speculate with a portion of their money. If you’re older, obviously, speculate with a little bit less, even if it’s 1%, but you should always have money invested as a what if, because if that what if comes out, or that comes to fruition, that what if could be worth 20, 30, 50 X of your entire portfolio. You should always have that kind of exposure to something like that. And the way you do is, buying stuff that everybody hates, not buying stuff that everybody likes. But in crypto where you’re looking at where the innovation’s coming from, where’s it coming?

Frank Curzio: I mean, DeFi. Daniel, I still think even people who invest in this, a lot of crypto people don’t understand DeFi. In a way of coming from Wall Street and understanding how banks make money, how the credit card processors make money, right? And, investment banking, regular banks. How Wall Street makes money. They make money by being a middleman. And that industry has not been disrupted, or hardly been disrupted. There’s still middlemen, where you have these investment bankers saying, “Hey, I know all these people, you have a good idea. Okay, well, I’m going to raise money for you. And I’m going to take a piece of that.” Right? They do create products. You have a lot of smart people at these. I’m not downplaying it.

Frank Curzio: What I’m saying is, that when you eliminate the middleman, which has happened in industry, after industry, after industry within the internet, with DeFi, now we’re talking about the biggest industry in the world. Trillions, and trillions, and trillions of dollars. And you’re looking at security tokens, infiltrating the bond market, where it’s not a liquid market and those spreads are huge. And if you look at Goldman Sachs, Morgan Stanley, JP Morgan, look how much money they make every quarter in their fixed income division, and you’ll see why. I know some people in that industry, especially one who’s mentored to me, he’s great. I got to actually call him, I haven’t called him in a while, one of the largest independent bond funds. But he tells of me, he’s pissed off. He’s like, so that’s why he’s so into security tokens. He wound up investing in my business through our token.

Frank Curzio: But, from that perspective of the disruption coming, I mean, people are like, “DeFi, this is cool.” I mean, you are looking at credit card processing, tens of trillions of dollars filtering through this. And again, you’re putting in the credit card and they’re charging it coming back. So, they’re just a middleman. Now, if you could eliminate that, which Bitcoin does and some cryptos do, now you open up a whole new world. So, you’re looking at what trends, Daniel, really quick. You’re looking at DeFi, which is huge, right? And people might say, “Well, it’s been a trend for a little while on crypto,” which is two years, that’s a long time in crypto.

Frank Curzio: The metaverse has to flow through crypto. It has to flow through crypto, and it will flow through crypto, and as crypto companies that have this technology right now, like the Central End, that’s a recommendation on our newsletter. We’ve done very, very well in. And, they’re lightyears ahead of everybody else, including Facebook. Earn to play, where if you look at this model, Dan, this is amazing to me. This is going to be massive going forward. Because if you look at the current system, where we used to go and play video games, and video games used to, Asteroids and Missile Command really back in the day. And then, you get into the Dave and Buster’s model where you play. And then afterwards, you get these tokens or whatever that are on a card, and you go there and you get stuffed animals.

Frank Curzio: Now, this is playing video games where you actually earn crypto, which is amazing. I think you’re going to see a big transformation. Not that you’re going to see more people get into the gaming industry, but this is what? Like a $200 billion a year industry, somewhere in that level. I mean this, a lot of that over next three to four years, I could see 60% of it, even more going to earn to play. And these guys like Take-Two, and EA, and Activision better, better look at this market, understand it, or you’re going to risk being AOL, because this is the new generation. This is the new model and everyone’s going for it right now. But these are things, and all the innovations that happen within crypto.

Frank Curzio: So getting back to that, I didn’t mean to go on my mini rant, since we’re running a little late here. But when you look at this, Daniel, the innovations coming here. It’s fantastic. And this is why I want people to invest in it, because it gives you the opportunity to invest in something that could offer you life-changing gains. And you don’t have that opportunity anymore, where you might think you’re a superstar buying Rivian, Rivian’s up 70% since its IPO. That’s a maximum you could have made in an investment, while the early investors in at single digits in the dollars have 10 new houses, and three helicopters that they’re going to buy.

Frank Curzio: So, crypto offers those gains for you, where you don’t see those gains and those returns for individual investors, for the average investor. And, that’s why it’s so exciting. That’s why I push the newsletter. And that’s why I’m glad so many people signed up. And I’m also glad that you’ve seen this pullback because, and we said that it could pull back. We want it to pull back. We have positioned, small positions in a lot of these new names where we could add to them, and that’s where the opportunity comes. That was long. Sorry.

Daniel Creech: That was. Cliff Notes, buy Bitcoin. Buy crypto.

Frank Curzio: There you go. See you later guys.

Daniel Creech: Yep.

Frank Curzio: frank@curzioresearch.com. Goodbye.

Daniel Creech: Too bad we’re long. I will tease this. We’ll have to talk about this next week. I have a wonderful worthless opportunity, that you have until February 25th to decide on, Frank. I’ll leave it at that.

Frank Curzio: You got to…

Daniel Creech: Totally, totally outside the box of the stock. Not stocks. It is a stock.

Frank Curzio: Just drop the microphone. That’s it. You good?

Daniel Creech: Yep.

Frank Curzio: All right, buddy.

Daniel Creech: Cheers.

Frank Curzio: All right. So Dan, thanks so much for coming by. Guys, really excited today, we’re launching Luke’s Big Money Trader. It’s at a special price point for Curzio Research listeners, where you’re going to get a year for free. And it’s the first new premier product we launched in over a year. So really, really exciting. Just trying to put out more products with more great people in front of you, as we expand our brand. And this is a product I’m really excited about, because it does target a market that few people like invest in, which is growth stocks. And as crazy as that sounds, a lot of people may have bought Facebook, may have bought Amazon, but they haven’t held it through all of this. Luke has a system that’s been tracking this, following the big money, investing alongside of it, which a lot has to do investing in growth stocks.

Frank Curzio: And now with this product, off of his Big Money Trader product. So, you look at this Big Money Trader coming in, is going have option strategies through a lot of these positions, and his next position’s coming out on Monday, which is exciting. You already see two in the newsletter, which they’ll offer you beta versions, but this is really exciting stuff that we’re launching this again. Special price point to you. If you guys are interested, fine. If not, no worries, but this is a newsletter, especially to Curzio One. I think you guys, we’re getting amazing, amazing feedback since that beta version has launched.

Frank Curzio: Our Curzio One members has access to all of our products and services, and for free forever, everything we produce going forward, and you pay a small annual fee, which is a good deal. So, if anyone’s interested in that, please call me. We open that membership up like once every two years. And it is a really fantastic value, but it is an expensive thing because again, you’re getting all the products and the services now, and what we offer in the future, which is cool. But really excited about this product, Big Money Trader. Any questions, any feedback, frank@curzioresearch.com.

Frank Curzio: But my team put this together, launching, and really excited time, really excited for Luke because Luke is a diehard. He loves his stuff, been doing it for more than a decade. He’s gotten fantastic returns, which a lot of you guys already know because he is writing for free for us, for such a while, for just a long time on our site, Curzio Research, but real exciting times. And I continue to put products, continue to put people in front of you guys, if I think that they can educate you and make you money. And for me, Luke’s one of those guys. So, I’m really, really excited.

Frank Curzio: Again, questions and comments, feel free to email me at frank@curzioresearch.com. Appreciate all the support. And I’ll see you guys tomorrow with a brand new interview. It’s someone I’m going to have a lot, a lot of fun with, and it’s going to be entertaining. I promise. So, I’ll see you tomorrow. Take care.

Announcer: Wall Street Unplugged is produced by Curzio Research, one of the most respected financial media companies in the industry. The information presented on Wall Street Unplugged is the opinion of its host and guests. You should not base your investment decisions solely on this broadcast. Remember, it’s your money and your responsibility.